Shattered Pixel
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Bomb IDing Compensation | Patreon Weekly #274
🕑 Added 2024-09-02 16:39:35 +0000 UTCHey Patrons, in this weekly I’m going to go over some changes I’m considering to possibly compensate for the changes to bomb IDing.
This weekly also includes an audio Q&A! You can find audio timestamps at the end of this weekly.
Backstory
In the v2.5.0 beta I’ve made a change to how explosions interact with equipment. Previously upgraded equipment would not be destroyed, which led to a strategy where players would purposefully use bombs to identify whether equipment was upgraded or not. This is obviously not intended, but I did understand that players were using it to help deal with inventory congestion (as un-upgraded gear was destroyed) and so I kept deciding to fix it later after more inventory management changes.
Later has become now, and based on the number of messages I’ve received I both underestimated how many people were using this exploit, and that many people were using it not just for inventory help but to completely avoid ever equipping something they didn’t know was upgraded beforehand. I now seriously regret not fixing this years ago, but here we are. Bomb IDing is not coming back, but the feedback is making me think about other adjustments I could make to soften the blow a little.
Bombs Themselves
One point I am seeing made a bunch is that bombs themselves aren’t exactly the most useful and bomb-IDing was a way to make them relevant, even if it was an exploit. It is true at the moment that bombs are quite underwhelming for their limited quantity and required setup.
A lot of the way bombs were designed was trying to account for pre-0.8.0 bosses, which were much more vulnerable to burst damage. Firstly, right away I can easily remove the bouncing mechanic, which largely existed to prevent bombs from being OP against Tengu as he existed in 2015. Damage could also be boosted, but I do want to still prevent them from doing huge amounts of burst, so I may also change bombs to simply break when hit by an explosion instead of exploding themselves.
Naturally, any buffs here may well apply to alchemy bombs in some form as well, but that would be designed afterward.
IDing and Inventory Management
As for the Equipment IDing half of things, I’m less inclined to make big changes here, as bomb IDing largely helped you circumvent IDing outright, which isn’t something I want to allow. I have gotten thinking about equipment IDing in general though, and have a couple ideas to take the edge off a little bit:
Stones of Disarming aren’t used very widely currently, and there’s also already so many ways to remotely trigger or disarm/destroy traps. I’m considering changing them to Stones of Dampen Curse, which would allow you to unequip a single cursed item, but wouldn’t help you actually cleanse it. This works a lot better as a weaker form of remove curse, and also gives players a new option when trying out several potentially cursed items.
Wells of Awareness are another possible thing to adjust. Currently, despite being about knowledge, these wells notably worse at IDing items compared to wells of health, which uncurse all worn items. I don’t know exactly how I’d buff them yet, but identified some amount of items in your inventory is an obvious option. Wells won’t appear consistently, so the effect could be quite strong, even so I don’t want it to be too strong.
I don’t yet have a specific plan as to if or when I might make these changes, although a patch for v2.5 seems likely if I do decide to add them. I’d love to hear what you guys think of this!
Audio Timestamps
This month there were 23 questions from 10 different patrons.
0:18 "after a long session of qna-scrounging to make sure the board was right i initiate a horsey battle! what is your response?" - radiantchaos
0:39 "have you ever been camping?" - radiantchaos
1:51 "There are a variety of passive weapon effects in the game (speed, accuracy, reach, etc.). Were there any other options that either haven't made the cut, or are considerations for other passive effects?" - Raynuva
3:43 "how was your day?" - Depresbian
6:26 "Are you feeling confident about dev work for the next update? It is going to be another big one!" - Veek
7:36 "if one of the non-boss enemy types had a change of heart and decided to become a hero, which would you have the most fun developing?" - Vorticia
8:57 "if you could put yourself into any fictional universe, what would you choose? (assuming you're a main character and not some rando). Well not literally a main character of that universe, you're you, but this is assuming you is a prominent character now" - radiantchaos
10:33 "do you still play deep rock?" - radiantchaos
11:58 "Do you think warrior is more boring than the other classes and if so do you think its a problem?" - Ehelos
13:42 "how useful would the trinkets be in real life?" - radiantchaos
14:54 "Given you have plans to fully expand out the Quest system, are there any plans to expand into the idea of Class-Specific Quests that arc over the entire run (e.g. Warrior repairing his Seal, Mage unsealing his power, etc.)?" - Raynuva
16:23 "Since you have expanded the Cursed Wand effects, are there plans to expand the Cursed Armor / Weapon effects?" - Raynuva
17:37 "Who are you making the sacrifice for when using the sacrificial altar? Vanilla PD mentions the Spirit of the Dungeon. Does something like that exist in Shattered PD?" - Block Vader
19:10 "what video games would each of the heroes like?" - radiantchaos
20:21 "Could there be a secret interaction with magical catalyst resulting in a unique trinket (just like there is the Ratmogrify secret)?" - Block Vader
21:43 "what's up with the cape of thorns? is it out for good or still in consideration as potentially a reworked artifact or even trinket" - Depresbian
22:29 "about what ratio of your work is coding vs social management?" - radiantchaos
25:01 "after cleric, what are other future classes you've thought about adding?" - Bolognathetoni
25:36 "why is the rat king so generous? why can't his subjects take after his example" - Bolognathetoni
26:21: "any new music on the go? (should specify i mean that you listen to, not for the game)" - radiantchaos
27:43 "what area's music do you like the most in shattered pixel dungeon (or boss theme or ascension theme, basically out of all the music in the game, what's your favorite)" - MAXIBOB
28:38 "I was wondering if there are any plans to implement new challenges or game modes in the future?" - MarcoTheDoomguy
29:43 "I’ve noticed in one other branch of Pixel Dungeon that coins were coded so that different textures appeared depending on the amount. Is this something you may consider for visial improvement of Shattered Pixel Dungeon?" - MarcoTheDoomguy
Comments
YouIG
I really like that idea of changing Stone of Disarming! I guess I've never used that stone to disarming traps ever. That was most useless item in SPD so far.
Joseph Dupas
yeah that totally makes sense, its removing something people were used to using and was pretty commonly shared knowlege. but it honestly wasnt op and it just kinda devalued id scrolls a lot.
Shattered Pixel
I do understand why it's frustrating for players who become very used to bomb IDing instead of ever trying on gear. That's the biggest reason why I regret not making this change quite a while ago.
Shattered Pixel
What you're describing is essentially a scroll of identification. The tricky thing here is that determining if an upgrade is upgraded or not is almost all of the value in IDing it, so any sort of stone effect has to be weaker than that, which is why I settled on something that makes trying out items less risky.
allowiscous
I quite like the the stones of dampen curse replacing stones of disarming. I would argue the proposed effect may not exactly be the best, considering the cost is an item that ultimately removes the curse altogether. I think something slightly separate, such as a stone of detect magic which determines if the object is cursed or shows upgrades if upgraded.
José Weliton do Nascimento Santos
Hello I want to say that the idea of stones is good. almost no use of current runes. I prefer to use levitation potions whenever possible!
Shattered Pixel
Just do be clear, do you mean that you'd prefer for stones of disarming to say the way they are, or do you mean my idea for stones of disarming is good?
Joseph Dupas
i definetly think everyone who is upset is a little strange, its a balence change on something that wasnt very good, the equipment cant be sold or used later if you bomb it and bombs are statistically better used elsewhere, i admit i used it for funsies but i agree with the change!
José Weliton do Nascimento Santos
Stones of Disarming is good!
