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The Delta Flyers - DS9 Life Support 313 Audio

🕑 Added 2025-02-10 05:00:05 +0000 UTC

Comments

Harmony through Time Mighty Mouse

This was a way to show Nog was changing

Hubert Ho

It was the S2 finale, "The Jem'Hadar". During their capture, Quark told Sisko that humanity's history was worse than Ferengi history with "Slavery. Concentration camps. Interstellar wars."

Garrett

Terry is always allowed to share her thoughts and opinions. Both Armin and Terry are encouraged to send us reaction videos for any and all episodes.

RichardBJ@hotmail.com

Where can see pictures of Robbie’s doggie? Walt?

Marian Bieniek

Yes, that's the one!

Russell Burbage

It was the last episode of the 2nd season when Quark and Sisko went camping with Nog and Jake

Marian Bieniek

Thank you, we do indeed appreciate all the time all of you spend doing this podcast ❤️ And apologies to your loved ones for the time spent away from each other ❤️

Siddhartha

I'm always caught off guard by how intelligent Armin is. Just a really erudite guy.

Marian Bieniek

I think it was in the episode The Jem Hadar, and restricting freedom of movement is definitely slavery!

Elisabeth Westner

Oh wow, I completely missed that speech...do you remember which episode it is? And UGH people (men) not realizing how problematic it is to not allow women to have careers or venture outside the house. I would hesitate to say that it's on the same level as slavery was in the US, but it sure isn't allowing them to live free lives equal to the men in their societies.

Elisabeth Westner

Catherine, I agree with you that the two girls were just props, and that makes me sad. It's rather TOS of them. And agree about the Jewish stereotype vs Ferengi....I can completely understand why Armin is very vocal about fighting back against it, as well he should be!

Marian Bieniek

I'm glad the issue of ferengi misogyny came up in these messages. In one episode, Quark gives speech about the Ferengi never having slavery on their planet, and clearly that's a lie!

sgtb99

I think “humanity” means the essence and soul of the individual in this instance. Of course Bashir would say that being human. We get it.

sgtb99

LOVE Kate❤️

Catherine Green

I am so happy that Terri is here to give a female viewpoint in general, it adds so much depth & understanding to the show as a whole.

Catherine Green

This is one of those times that saying “oh, they didn’t realise it was established in TNG” really doesn’t help 😂 A weird design is a weird design. Although, in A Matter of Time Crusher does say that they’ve got sterilisation fields or something, which means they don’t need masks & gloves any more. Even so there is absolutely no good reason for that hat!

Catherine Green

I’m glad this conversation is being had! The two girls in this episode were just props to allow Jake & Nog to have their disagreement. No-one asked how they felt about the whole thing. This show made some excellent points about racism but still had some of that old 90s blind spot about mysogyny. However there really are people out there who associate Ferengi with Jewish stereotypes. I’ve seen (& reported) it on Facebook. So yeah the racism is real and I can understand why Armin wants to focus on it.

Elisabeth Westner

His bedhead photos on FB are pretty amazing.

Elisabeth Westner

Also, thinking back to early DS9 episodes where the DF mentioned that some characters on the show were being pretty mean to Quark...well, for instance, Kira was pretty nasty to him and when talking about him to others, but OTOH, he behaved very creepily towards Kira and also does towards the Dabo girls. So...can't say as that I blame her for that??

Elisabeth Westner

It's kind of unfortunate that the podcast mostly alternates between Armin and Terry. I understand why Armin gets to do the Ferengi episodes, but it would be great if Terry was allowed to weigh in on their attitudes towards female.

Jess Hrudey

100% agree and I do think that some of Armin’s bugbear on this is because some people do indeed hate Ferengi for those cheater/crook stereotypes. I just am not sure he recognizes that, for example, when the patreon supporters with voting rights give a Ferengi episode a low rating its not because they hate the Ferengi for the stereotypes about their greediness, it’s pretty much always the misogyny. Well, tbf I’m assuming that’s why the prophets and all them are giving a lower rating and Armin is assuming its discrimination against Ferengi as a whole. Anyway, it’s an issue I hope they take some time to talk a bit more about, esp when Moogie shows up.

Elisabeth Westner

The Ferengi get a bad rap from Starfleet as being all crooks and cheaters, and DS9 does occasionally show some Ferengi who aren't like that (Nog being one, at least as the series goes on) and I do think that Armin has a point that it's racism to believe that ALL Ferengi are cheaters and crooks when some of them aren't. (For the first time I'm realizing that the Ferengi are a stand-in for how so many racists view Jewish people or Gypsies...ugh racism.) But yeah, the Ferengi sexism *as a species* is WAY worse than their sometimes being cheaters and crooks, and while there are a few Ferengi males who seem to be more progressive about it, as a whole the males of that race are pretty despicable to treat their females that way.

sgtb99

Bariel’s death does have meaning…the successful negotiation was due to his input.

sgtb99

O’Brien ruled out sabotage on the shuttle accident.

Jess Hrudey

Agree with both of you and I’m glad to see this discussion here. I think in many cases these guys (particularly Robbie) have fairly progressive views, but there are definitely things they talk about here that just rubs the wrong way. And while I agree with Armin that it was worthwhile in DS9 to show that Starfleet isn’t perfect, I don’t think he fully understands that people often don’t like the Ferengi not because of racist reasons but because they treat women like shit.

sgtb99

What I have noticed about DS9 is the cast is EXCELLENT. It matters not who the focus is.

Elisabeth Westner

That's a good point. I noticed when I watched this episode recently that she's really hoarse and so I went to Star Trek Alpha to see if there was a note about her being sick during filming and alas, she was. That's really tough that they made the actors film even when they were really sick.

Elisabeth Westner

I agree and I came here to the comments to say this. I absolutely despise the way Ferengi culture was written so incredibly misogynistically throughout DS9. I don't want to spoil the rest of the series for Gawa or Robbie but even with some of the small wins Ferengi females get it's still really awful (and a lot of those wins aren't even really wins). It's indicative of a writers room that has few or no women in the room and has an attitude that the women on the show are merely there to serve as props for the men and to help drive the men's stories forward. And while I get that they wanted to give Sisko the attitude that it's not nice to judge other cultures by the same standards you judge your own, in this case that viewpoint misses the mark. Other cultures on Star Trek are judged for having standards the Federation finds abhorrent, so why suddenly is it totally fine with Starfleet (or Sisko, anyway, as Starfleet's representative on DS9) for one culture to abuse and denigrate the females in their society? Ugh, it's really, really awful. Robbie is usually very progressive and anti-discrimination in these podcasts so I'm rather disappointed that he didn't take that viewpoint here.

Sarah Berkner

Not always. All good captains break a rule sometimes when it's the right thing to do but they don't always have to break the rules.

Sarah Berkner

I wouldn't recommend telling Nana her hair looks like Wil Wheaton's when you have her on, I mean, he has nice hair but...

sgtb99

So not important to see the negotiation or the operation.

sgtb99

Bariel was definitely channeling Data.

sgtb99

You all are laughing heartily and I get it’s because the way they did it was funny, but the rampant misogyny is despicable and was a mistake and that has not been acknowledged here.

sgtb99

Sisko always breaks rules, like all good Starfleet captains do.

sgtb99

I attributed Kai Winn, not looking right or being a little off was because she was in a shuttle accident that was serious and the Vedic was seriously hurt and they possibly couldn’t do the talks. So that absolutely tracked. I think it enhance her performance.

Marcy Beard

I *adore* Nog's line "Money is money, but women are bet-tah!" especially the delivery and the accent on the last 2 syllables. On the flipside, I have not, do not, and will not ever care for Kai Winn.

Andrew Cano

I do remember that. Guess they wanted to make it look futuristic. I don’t mind the color or lack of facial covering (again, would affect the actor’s performance) but that hat. Just no 😂

Charlotte Marks

IIRC, similar surgical gear was used on The Next Generation.

Andrew Cano

I couldn’t agree more with the hosts regarding the ridiculousness of the surgical scrubs. The hat, in particular, is just distracting. Not to nit pick too much, but I do wish they had found a way to incorporate some type of clear face shield to provide plausible protection from infection while not obscuring the actors’ faces. I do understand it would have been difficult to prevent fogging.

Andrew Cano

I agree. This was a poignant way to bid farewell to both the forced relationship and the Bareil character that just didn’t seem to fit Philip Anglim. That final scene with Kira at his deathbed really hit me emotionally. Re: Bashir, Siddig El Fadil/Alexander Siddig’s delivery of the “Neither shall I” line never fails to send a chill up my spine. Great turning point for the character.!

sgtb99

While I was never a fan of the Bariel-Kira relationship. Over 30 years later, I still got emotional when he died. That was an excellent episode, Bashir was great.