Reinbach
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Patreon Pin Up 6/25/18
🕑 Added 2018-06-25 21:37:12 +0000 UTC Shampoo here, (yes that is her name) comes from a classic anime called Ranma 1/2. I'll summarize the show as best I can: It's a romantic comedy series about a group of teenage martial artists, most of which had the misfortune of falling into a mystic hot spring that curses them to shape-shift (usually into an animal of some kind) whenever they get splashed with cold water. Adding to their misfortune is that the threat of being spontaneously splashed with cold water is very real and lurks everywhere. Rainstorms occur instantly and without warning, and around every corner waits some asshole just emptying a bucket of ice water or spraying a hose in the street without so much as a glance where they're aiming.Ranma is one of those Japanese love comedies where you can watch for 100 episodes and never see any two characters so much as kiss. The entertainment factor is not about buildup and payoff, it's about watching these poor dopes constantly deal with their romantic ambitions going up in smoke for one reason or another. Likable characters are mandatory for such a set up, and I think the show succeeds there. But just how it succeeds is something I want to learn from.
To put it mildly, cast of this show is made up of some seriously flawed young people, but their cons are balanced with their pros expertly in most cases. So despite them all being kind of awful human beings it's somehow still hard for me to pick a favorite.
Take the star, Ranma himself. He's a misogynistic little twerp who inexplicably still adopts the "girls are gross" mentality of an adolescent boy despite being well into his teens. He also whines constantly about his particular curse, despite the fact that he got off way lighter than anyone else who fell into the hot spring. But, he also generally sticks up for anyone being bullied, and tends to go out of his way to help others when he can. So despite his quirks he can be easy to root for.
But a more relevant example is Shampoo. She wants to marry Ranma, and will attempt to totally murder anyone she thinks is in the way of that goal. She lies, she manipulates, and she cheats in any contest that she can. She even has a perfectly nice guy who's in love with her that she treats like crap. And while she's often the antagonist of a particular episode, I wouldn't say she counts as one of the villains. Why not? Well, she's adorable for one, and she's very polite and respectful to anyone who isn't unfortunate enough to be in her way.
I know this is a long post, but this is the type of thing that really interests me as a writer. In my case, I've got some male characters to introduce in my comic, and I think if they were all nice guys like Royce and Warren that would get old quick. Writing a character that's likable despite serious flaws is something I'd really like to be able to master and replicate as needed. If you guys have any pointers or just happen to be a Ranma fan let me know in the comments. Who's you're favorite character? Mine's Ryoga, because he has a shitty sense of direction just like I do.
Comments
Reinbach
Hey thanks I did my best! Mastering the Asian look is certainly a goal of mine.
Reinbach
That it did! XD
Reinbach
I'm a big fan of her too. Ryoga is my favorite guy, but she may be my favorite girl. Or at least she's tied with Ukyo.
Squid Hills
Also also, you totally succeeded in making her actually look f**king Chinese! That's fantastic!
Squid Hills
(I wish we could edit posts) Also, I dig this Shampoo of yours. It's been too long since I've seen this character or watched the show. The part I like most about Shampoo, though, was the fact that she turned into an adorable little kitten... and Ranma was deathly afraid of cats. It made her pursuit of him all the more hilarious.
Squid Hills
Favorite character? Kodachi Kuno, because of that wicked, wicked laugh of hers.
Reinbach
I know they eventually replaced him with the Inu Yasha guy, but man he sounded way to evil to be a hero lol.
Reinbach
I liked Ukyo too. Always wanted to see her hook up with Ryoga, as that first movie seemed to imply they'd end up together. I also followed the dub, which I actually really liked. In a cheesy late 80's early 90's sort of way I thought the cast sounded great, everyone except Ranma lol. Why they got a woman to do the male half's voice is beyond me. Especially since a DIFFERENT woman was doing the female half. There has to be a story behind that somewhere.
WarSapphire
Good work with Shampoo giving that guy some BJ action while fondling her breasts. Shampoo was one of my favorite characters, along with Ukyo Kuonji. I always liked the little entrance theme they gave Shampoo when she first appeared in the series. I actually only got into watching Ranma (mostly dubbed version) years ago because it was mentioned in a trailer in the PS2 game "Inuyasha Secret of the cursed Mask". The show was certainly funny and enjoyable to watch with nearly every character being likable in their own way.
ScuzzBucket
Also, Maison Ikkoku is the GREATEST LOVE STORY EVER. Godai is a great "nice guy" character, explaining the pratfalls of his character type- he's easily taken advantage of, often weak-willed, and will probably have a pretty middle-road career and never really excel because he's too kind. But that line "The woman I love cries, gets angry, turns to ice, jumps to conclusions... but when she laughs, the world is mine." PERFECTION.
ScuzzBucket
The movies are pretty crazy-fun. The first is the best "thinker" movie, but the one of them has the most '80s song ever (in English!) for the opening number. Fantastic. The show was influential to the "Jem and the Holograms" creators, who copied the show's openings for the various Jem & Misfits videos. You can sort of see the connection. Ataru being a lusty, horndog pervert is a fun characteristic though, and you're right- a good "template" to use for a more-negative TRW character. Make their flaws more FUNNY than anything and people are more likely to forgive their flaws and like them anyway.
Reinbach
Nevermind! Found the entire series on Youtube. That's what happens when publishers drop the ball: pirates pick it up!
Reinbach
Where can I find that show? Even its so-called North American video distributor only has the manga available online. Surely its available to stream somewhere?
Reinbach
Cool! Never heard of that one, I'll look it up. :)
The BRM
If you haven't, read/watch Urusei Yatsura for more in the vein of Ranma... and with characters that I think work a bit better and are less archetypal even if they are painted with a broad brush. It was her first major manga, and Lum is still my favorite heroine of hers. You can see the genesis of the Ranma formula there. Another of her works that might help inform what you are doing with TRL would be Maison Ikkoku, it starts with similarly broad characters at first (though in a more realistic setting) but over time you get to see and know them as people... and it has actual romantic progression. Incredibly good romantic progression.
ScuzzBucket
It's not like Warren & Royce were 100% "Nice Guys" either. One made his debut boinking his teenage stepdaughter on the couch while his wife wasn't home, and the other has traded homework for BJs. They're quite the scamps, if you look at them from a certain point of view :)! "Jerk With a Heart of Gold" characters work well, too. Or people who TRY to be nice, but have too many social flaws or obsessive traits to work properly in society :). Also: guys who are negative/jerks, but in a FUNNY way. As TRW is quite humorous as a comic, sillier men can fit in quite nicely. Like a total narcissistic douchebag, or something.
ScuzzBucket
He was pretty funny. I'm sure modern-day viewers would consider him guilty of sexual assault for "glomping" Shampoo all the time, of course, but his weepiness was amusing :).
Reinbach
I guess as always it's all about striking a balance. As if there was a set formula to follow there'd be no such thing as unlikable characters. I'll just have to keep at it. :)
Reinbach
Nice! I liked him too.
That black guy
Mousse was my dude
ScuzzBucket
Haha, wow, this is a blast from the past! Very beautiful! I loved watching Ranma 1/2, though I got into it YEARS after most Anime fans did! I was the oldest kid in my family, and had no rich friends, so finding anime VHS tapes was TOUGH- I didn't watch this series till they came out with a DVD set. I found the constant hijinks very amusing, and the martial arts aspect kept it fun to watch, as well. My favorite character was Kasumi- the lovely, innocent, nice-girl-next-door types are absolutely my thing :). Regarding likable characters, it's tricky, ESPECIALLY in a porn comic. With porn, the audience is immediately a tad jealous of the attention the males get, so the author usually makes them as much like the imagined audience as possible- "nice guy" schmucks who are ordinarily not good with women. You see that a lot in harem anime, and stuff like "Oh My Goddess". When it's JERKS getting the girls, the audience can get really annoyed with it, and REALLY hate the characters. The backlash Derek got when you introduced his traits reminds me of that (where it's said he can get any woman he wants, but acts like a shit online). Nobody really likes the "bad ending" of the jerk getting the girl, and in a porn comic, that's kind of hard to avoid- if it NEVER happens, then it's just "nice people having nice sex", which doesn't always work for dramatic purposes. In other fiction, villains are often the most popular characters. But, like, an antagonistic character (a brute, jerk, criminal, egotist, etc.) would be a great villain a REGULAR comic, but in a PORN comic? The fans will most likely hate them with a much greater venom. Especially if the jerk is screwing a NICE girl- that's the thing that people ragequit over. Now if it's evil women and evil men fucking each other, then it becomes kind of sexy again. A comic where douchebags get all the girls they like usually skew a lot "darker" and go all the way into Non-Con. You can still have "Nice" characters with intense flaws, of course. Just not really NASTY ones like selfishness, arrogance, elitism, manipulation, etc. They can be wimpy, easily-led, stupid, boorish, ill-mannered, and ignorant without being mean. It's a complicated issue, though. You don't want the comic to be empty of antagonists, but you've gotta deal with a primary male audience who often want to have "surrogate" male characters they can live vicariously through. A happy medium seems to be cases like Mr. Birch, who fucks a hot, nice girl, but is IMMEDIATELY caught and found out. Another thing could be characters who have tons of negative traits, but one or two good ones that are shown at times- like an ill-mannered lout who is nonetheless really attentive to his lovers' needs and tender in bed, or a bad guy who desperately loves someone he can't have. Little things like that can make the villains sympathetic, and soften their unlikable traits.
