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Irwin's Journey 401: Another step forward

🕑 Added 2025-03-23 18:58:53 +0000 UTC

Comments

Torn2.0

If my guess is right, the purified cards being individual pitches, then I think I know where this is going. Purifying cards may be the first step to Irwin learning to purify his own soulforce. Then he should be able to separate all of his types (chords) into their component Types (pitches). He would then have a greater number of Types to work with and could recombine them into far more types then he currently can work with. FIRE + METAL = Firesteel. SOUND + METAL = Whispersteel. FIRE + SOUND = Explosion?

Carrarn

Typo, should have been handcard. Behind a keyboard, my fingers just go to fast sometimes

Carrarn

Okay, I loved this discussion! Also, Im not going go give details for now, except for one. I love organic systems that do not have an almighty creator. Do with this info what you will :) Also thanks for the entertainment :))

Antony Claughton

On the original question, I believe the typing is just humans/card users/smiths trying to group and understand the categories they're seeing in the wild. But what is more interesting, is that all cards were originally dropped by a living creature. And it seems clear that the types of cards dropped by specific races is pretty homogenous. This would imply a direct link between DNA, and evolutionary required traits, and the soul and therefore soul shard affiinities. I don't think it is cultural definitions of fire or light.

Antony Claughton

I can't help thinking for many people more pure cards may be a bad thing. Slotting and combining a set of pure cards that had different affinities may be more difficult. And for most users, having variety can significantly improve their capability in a variety of situations. Just look at Irwin's first cards. It also allows more affinities for later cards to match and be slotted. Where I think it will shine is where you needed to specialise anyway. So, the obvious example is what we've been told about central branch teleporters, where they may have 5-6 dedicated soul cards to teleportation elements (and creating soul force). It is possible you could get the same bang for your buck with half the cards, if they were all absolutely pure to the purpose required. I can imagine people who are certain in their paths would could have soulcards created from all aligned pure cards, and would be devestating. E.g. healers. Runesmiths. You might still want the first card to be a variety to give enough sympathy with other types so the third/fourth/etc. soul cards could be something else than the focus. But having a second soulcard all of the one pure focus, oomph!

Antony Claughton

Oh, and with the kids, they've just lost/had maimed 6 blademaidens. These would be their teachers, friends, guides across the last 18 months. I expect this to hit pretty hard. Plus the deaths of the chaos whales.

Torn2.0

I used wavelength because it allowed the light bulb to laser analogy. However, the story uses a sound and music analogy. What may be going on is that each "type" is a single chord. A handcard is a single part (soprano or alto or tenor) or maybe instrument (This handcard is all of the violins in the orchestra). A heartcard/soulcard is a full song (the Hallelujah Chorus), and a worldcard is the entire work (Handel's Messiah). What it seems like Irwin is doing is breaking a "type" (chord) down into a single Type (pitch). Fire, at its most fundamental) would be like A440, a single pitch, no harmonies or overtones. The difference between whispersteel and metal may be the other notes in the chord. Maybe metal is the single pitch, or maybe there is something even more fundamental beneath the two.

Not Me

Sure, the analogy makes sense. But I think I'm asking something slightly different; what makes a certain wavelength correspond with a certain power? Suppose you want something pure green - you'll probably accept something with a wavelength of 500 nm, then strip away any light that doesn't have the exact same wavelength. Then you might ask yourself: why 500, and not 501 or 499? Surely you'd get an equally pure color if you picked a wavelength of 501 nm and got rid of anything 500 or lesser and 502 or greater. What's the magic that makes 500 a target wavelength and not 499 or 501? One of the possibilities is that these target wavelengths are all pre-defined by a comprehensive card system maker. I don't think this is particularly satisfying because the card system seems adaptive to new types (recall: volcano titan card) and is willing to have overlap in types, e.g. metal vs whispersteel. Another possibility that I think might fit better is that it accepts some sort of external influence, that 500 is green because someone (society? Irwin?) believes that 500 is green. And if this belief is the foundation of card typings, perhaps there's something belief-based that Irwin can do to interact with card typings. Of course, that's not necessarily the case, depending on how the author feels, but at least that's the direction I followed the question. It's not something that absolutely needs answering.

Albert Benny Oliyakkattil

Tftc! The total chapter count and word count will increase, but I hope you can do as Antony said. Flesh out the Basil and Scintilla chapters. There is no names apart from the main cast mentioned. Even though the readers won't remember, it would be best if more detailing is done there. It is a glaring escape and you can have more tension. With Basil, more Chaos Whale lore can be incorporated

Albert Benny Oliyakkattil

Agree

Torn2.0

What I think is happening is that the card types are different "wavelengths" of soulforce. Think of a normal card like a light bulb, it has a lot of different "wavelength" of light. Irwin is making a laser, just one specific "wavelength". He is making a card that is just fire, no nuance or complexity. He isn't making a pyrokinesis card. He isn't making a candle card. He is making the FIRE card, just fire. It probably will be different from normal cards.

Antony Claughton

Ok, going back to your question after the last chapter about structure. I would definitely not be scattering these segments from other viewpoints like this where they follow each other. If you're cutting away, ESPECIALLY if you're leaving it on a cliffhanger, then the chapters should be combined. Indeed, I think it would have been better to have had a Concerto 'weekend', with the sleep-in chapter, the rescue, and their arrival and update at Eluathor all in back-to-back chapters. Also, I think you should also flesh out the escape from the Oculithar; these books don't have anywhere near as much action so having a few chapters back-to-back, building tension, and a little more detail makes sense. I would be building this up. Instead, you've cut from that to Irwin for an update that could occur anytime, and then back. It is frustrating. If you want to have cuts to/from Irwin to allow for the passage of time, I'd put in mini-cut aways to less important characters. Like learning what is happening on some of the worlds we've seen. Or when whats-his-name the teleporter gets released/or gets back. Or what happens when a report of Irwin being made Diamond arrived in the central smithing world. These could be very small snippets. Jumping to someone important such as Scintallia or Daubautim for a snippet is fine, as long as you're not then leaving the story hanging at an important bit. The snippet of Doomblade was a perfect example of a good cut-away.

Not Me

Thanks for the chapter! It's good to see some vertical growth going on again! I wonder which forging skills this sort of chaotic soulforce separation is primarily coming from - is it an epiphany from noticing how his own soulscape grows by absorbing chaotic soulforce, or a byproduct of a greater understanding of card typing from having made cards from scratch, or a simple growth of basic metal purification, enhanced by all his practice and increased sensitivity skills? I'm interested to see a little bit of how all the skills are building on one another. Speaking of his improved understanding of card type purity, I wonder actually makes card types. "Utility" strikes me as a sort of secondary typing that is a categorization made by people, a utility card might be any class of card that isn't primarily a weapon, attack, or physical enhancement, although the boundaries are nebulous enough that there's probably utility weapons (such as hammers) or physical enhancements that have utility (unbreakable climbing grip, for instance). But it seems that this sort of typing exists within the cards themselves as an idea that we would generally recognize. Are the card typings collectively generated by the Portal Gallery culture, or Ambraz' specific reading/interpretation of the cards, or by the initial card-slotting Galadin of long ago? Different cultures have different ideas wrapped up in the same concept, or do not identify some concepts as a distinct thing; one culture may treat the sun as the unitary dominant force in the world, as light, life, fire, truth, and such, while some other culture might treat the sun as a coequal occupant of the sky as the moon, as half of a balanced system and a necessary counterpart, and more modern cultures might just look up and see a nuclear ball of gas. Whether someone's conception of the sun is more pure and correct depends on what lens you view it through. Is Irwin purifying his card types towards extant concepts, or do his own ideas and conceptions of what card types should be have influence, too? Can he inject his will or close understanding of a concept into a card to improve its type purity? Or can he even willfully create his own unique card types or card type variants (such as a species card based upon his own unique constitution)?

Antony Claughton

What do you mean by using a heartcard? Because he isn't shattering a heartcard at the moment.

Antony Claughton

One, and more of your own soulforce than most people will ever have," Ambraz said, but ==> unfinished sentence Could the two of you get everything read? ==> Could the two of you get everything ready? had ranged attack ==> had ranged attacks

Carrarn

AHhhh right! Yes - thats the horrors of having different times. It's fine if its in your favor, but things sadly don't always go that way. I knew that when I started it, and it was a pretty hard choice. That said, I think it added flavor to the world - besides, it has a reason :P

Nicholas Del Rossi

Ten years on Eleuther have passed sense they were, due to the x2 speed.

Carrarn

Ten years? Not sure what you mean - About the handcards - Irwin is closing in on creating hand cards from a resonance seed and his own soulforce but its easier to do with a heartcard. So thats what he is doing.

Adunn

10 years, that honestly sucks. Also I’m not sure I’m understanding what’s happening in the beginning of the chapter. Are they literally turning a normal handcard into 2 handcards?

Eric M

Edit: while Zender and Basil began chatting with Zender - I think you should make it 'while Basil began chatting with Zender'

Eric M

Edit: as extensive as my type-breathe is - I think you want breadth there

Carrarn

I didn't manage to reach the part I was hoping for, but we will have a full Irwin's chapter next Friday that should have it.


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