Novus
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Haven's Port and the Future - Mildly Important
🕑 Added 2023-04-14 03:56:11 +0000 UTCTLDR Version: The poll is to help me get an idea what all my patrons are here for. So I can better figure out what I should do when Haven's Port eventually finishes. Please vote.
Okay folks, time for that talk I've been hinting at/promising for a bit! First, before I say anything else, let me reassure you that Haven's Port isn't going anywhere immediately. There is at least one more full build required after the currently-in-progress build. And, in truth, I actually expect there will likely be two more full builds. That means that I'm well out in front on getting everyone properly warned about the game's upcoming ending. But it needs to be talked about eventually and I'm well aware that not everyone reads every post. So if I start now, by the time the game fully winds down, hopefully everyone will be on the same page.
With that bit said, I'm next going to cover the three reasons that the game is ending at all. After all, given the format of Haven's Port, couldn't I just keep adding to it forever? Well...the answer to that is complicated and actually 'no.' So...reasons.
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1) We're reaching the end of the originally planned content for Haven's Port. The game was always intended to have four islands. The Port/Starter Island, the Main Island (technically called Haven's Home, though it's name is rarely referenced in-game), Rose Garden and Jerta. The last two were originally envisioned as places to expand specific content types, such a race/species groups (like the Centaurs). (Interestingly enough, making those two islands faction-specific actually wasn't part of the original plan. That was a suggestion from one of my longest-running Patrons, Dark Jade. The idea made so much sense, though, that I immediately adopted it into my planning.) Likewise, I've hit most of the content types I planned for, even if not quite as in-depth as I'd hoped for in some places.
2) The game is reaching the limits of the TWINE engine. For those of you who were around when I made The Dungeon of Lewdity, you might remember my unpleasant surprise to discover that there actually is such a thing. TWINE is a wonderful engine for what it is, but it isn't actually designed to tell such massive, sprawling stories. As I discovered with The Dungeon of Lewdity, there's a sort of soft limit on size from a pure memory point of view. There's been some improvements to the engine in the years since I made that game...but even so, I've hit the point where the TWINE app itself lags when I work on Haven's Port's code. It lags pretty badly, in point of fact. And it's only going to get worse with a couple more builds worth of content. I'm expecting after another couple of builds that, frankly, it will probably be bordering on non-functional.
It's sort of hard to blame the engine, honestly. As of Build 19, Haven's Port has over 270,000 words and 811 'passages.' It's easy to lose sight of just how big the game actually is if you're looking at it build-to-build. But when you look at it more objectively, it's one of the largest games out there. A few games, like the long running Trials in Tainted Space, are bigger...but games like that are basically the only competition Haven's Port has for sheer scale. And most of them are pure/near pure text games.
3) On a personal level...I've grown past Haven's Port. As I think I've shown with Left Hand Magic, my ability to get good graphics out of Daz3d had grown massively since I first started Haven's Port. And that's not even talking about the switch from purely still-images to fairly high-quality animations. Moreover, from a Writing standpoint...Haven's Port was actually sort of frustrating from the onset. Even when I first started it, the framework I designed for Haven's Port just didn't allow me to get the most out of my writing ability. The 'Date' mechanic was, in fact, originally not a thing. I added it to the game out of pure frustration with not being able to do some slightly more involved relationships. Add in the limitations of what the TWINE engine will actually allow me to do and you get a formula without much room for farther improvement.
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For these three reasons combined, the end of Haven's Port as an actively developed game is coming eventually. Given how long it's been running, that's a little sad...but only a little. I think I can call the game a pretty successful undertaking at this point. And it will be nice to be able to label another game as 'finished.' It's also hardly the end of the road for the Patreon, which is the real reason I'm bringing this up. And the reason that this post is a poll. The poll, this time, is for purely fact-finding purposes. To help me prepare for what happens after Haven's Port.
Obviously, even once Haven's Port wraps up, Left Hand Magic will still be in production. That's not going to change. But what I don't know, is how many of you are here for one game or the other. Frankly, I have no frame of reference, at all, for how popular the two games are. They are very different animals, after all. With Left Hand Magic being a fairly traditional Visual Novel. And Haven's Port being a Free Roamer style game, with little in the way of plot but a lot of exploration/variety.
This means that, currently, I'm struggling to figure out what to do after Haven's Port is finished. To be brutally honest here, what I would like to do is simply double down on Left Hand Magic. To do monthly releases of that game and finish it much more quickly as a result. I originally started the pattern of making two games simultaneously when I was first trying to break into the adult gaming community. And not all of the reasons I did that are relevant any longer.
At the time, I didn't want to chance losing people's interest when I ended one game and started another. The start of virtually any game is pretty weak, after all. How many of you routinely skip over games because they are first releases? Version 0.01? Often from unknown and unproven developers? I know I'm certainly guilty of doing that! And I'm not particularly ashamed of doing so, either. There are a lot of games that get abandoned after one or two small releases. I typically won't even play something until it's had at least three content releases, as until that point I don't have any faith that the game won't be randomly abandoned when the developer realizes 'oh wait, this is actually hard, and not an instant road to $$$.' I'm quite willing to make exceptions to that loose rule for new games by known quantities. But that's another kettle of fish entirely...though a somewhat relevant one, given that I'd like to think I'm a known quantity at this point.
Regardless, back then, working on two games was my way of overcoming this problem. By staggering when I started them, I could guarantee than at least one of my actively-in-development games would have a significant amount of content at all times. Allowing new games the chance to get off the ground without all my patrons losing interest. Originally, I even developed them side-by-side, releasing content for two different games every month. Though I eventually did away with that idea as too unwieldy.
All of that, however, was...several years ago. I'd like to hope that I've long since proven I'm not the type to randomly vanish mid-game, leaving people unsatisfied. And at this point, each of my game projects are big enough (with the exception of The Morning After, which was deliberately small) that only updating them every-other-month is becoming a liability. Not only does it make fans of any given game wait longer between releases...but it also forces me to put one thought-process down and pick up another every month. This results in making it easy for me to forget exactly what I was planning build-to-build. No matter how good the notes I take are. From my perspective, switching to a one-game, every-month release cycle would be the best call. I could finish games quicker and move onto the next one faster. Instead of a game taking 2+ years from start to finish, I could do something closer to a game a year. Which would be nice for everyone, I think.
HOWEVER.
I...don't actually know what all of you are here for. Left Hand Magic may be the more technically advanced/higher-quality game. But it's also a more traditional Visual Novel, in a market saturated with a lot of games of that style. Haven's Port, Chastity Quest, The Dungeon of Lewdity...and even Eros Academy and The Sexy Cosplay Cafe? All of them are in the more free-roam style experiences. Which are pretty rare birds, as adult games go. If that vast majority of you are here for that sort of game, then it would behoove me to start up another game in that style after Haven's Port ends. Now wouldn't it?
So...RESEARCH TIME!
Please take the time to vote in the attached poll. I've kept it restricted to single votes per person intentionally, because I want to know what you all are, collectively and individually, MOST into. Though you'll note I include some options that are combinations. If you are, for example, into both games fairly equally. There's also an option for it being the kinks rather than the specific game that you're here for. I wouldn't exactly be surprise if a lot of you are here for, in example, Chastity content. I'm one of only two creators I know of that uses that theme significantly. And it shows up in...basically all of my games. Likewise, I provide a lot more Bondage content than...pretty much anyone else, full stop.
If there isn't an option that you feel fully fits what you like/dislike the most, feel free to comment with more detail! For that matter, if you simply want to provide more feedback or have an opinion to add, comment! Heck even if you just have a question about any of this! Than feel free to comment for those as well! The purpose of this post is to gather in as much feedback as I can, so that I can begin the planning process for what will happen when Haven's Port is eventually finished. I will also happily respond to Direct Messages, if you don't feel comfortable commenting publicly.
Comments
Novus
I'm guessing you used the wrong patch version for your copy ;-). But you seem to have gotten it all fixed! Good. And thanks for letting me know! Sorry I didn't reply, but for some reason it didn't notify me this time of the comment...
Michael Faux
Hi Novus I did not apply the 19.1 patch. I will apply it now and see if that sorts it out. Edit: So I applied that patch and it appears to have fixed the issue but has created an even bigger issue which is that no images are being displayed in any scenes. Instead of there being images it displays a missing images icon for each image. Edit: Never mind I managed to fix the issue. All is good now thanks Novus.
Novus
...okay, I'm a tiny bit of an idiot. Because I forgot that I didn't discover the issue until AFTER I released Build 19. Meaning that the default Build 19 release still has the bug. Did you apply the 19.1 patch that's available in the release post? (https://www.patreon.com/posts/havens-port-19-5-79444916). The patch is just a fixed HTML file that was made specifically for that bug. Before I go digging into anything else, I need to make sure you applied that and are still getting the issue...
Michael Faux
Thanks, Novus for having a look Hopefully, it is fixed for Build 20.
Novus
Crud. Still something wrong then. Thanks for letting me know. I'll take a look at it tonight and see if I can figure out what's going wrong.
Novus
Ah, a fellow being of culture, I see ;-). You're right about it being too rare in adult gaming. And when Bondage/Chastity content DOES pop up, developers have a nasty tendency to head straight for the dark stuff. Humiliation, degradation, rape, forced feminization, all the seriously not-so-healthy-for-normal-realtionships stuff. It's like creators can't wrap their head around the idea of bondage in a positive light. Which is WEIRD to me, since if you actually go out into the BDSM community, there's a pretty large scene which pushes healthy BDSM culture. It's actually why I started out with bondage content right from Eros Academy, as I wanted to show a more positive spin on things I couldn't find anywhere else. I was seriously frustrated with the lack, and had a 'fine, I'll just do it myself!' moment, at one point... I also get what you mean about the 'actual gameplay' thing. Truth be told, I wasn't actually wild about switching to a visual novel format for Left Hand Magic. I very much prefer making games with more player agency. It was simply an acknowledgement of my limitations. That, as a solo developer, I'd reached a point where I could EITHER make a major boost to quality, OR continue with the free-roam style gameplay. But I couldn't manage both. Not alone and with the skills/assets/support I had at the time. What I would REALLY love to do is make a free-roam game like Chastity Quest or Haven's Port...but with the quality of Left Hand Magic. That would require either a major boost to my funding...or more people, unfortunately. And don't worry about me continuing to make content along these fetish lines ;-). I not only enjoy making it...but it's kinda my niche at this point :-p. It would take something pretty major to make me turn away from making Bondage/Chastity/Etc a major focus point of any game I make. Thanks for the feedback!
Michael Faux
Hi Novus I had this issue on Build 18 at first and then when I updated to Build 19 the issue still persisted. I also tried a new save on Build 19 and the issue occurred in the exact same way as on my updated save from build 18.
Novus
Honestly, that's kind of what I'm hoping to happen. And future games don't have to be VNs either. But getting feedback like this poll was something I needed, so that I have some idea if I'm going to have people abandoning ship in droves if I don't start up another free-roamer game while I finish Left Hand Magic. Thanks for taking the time to comment!
Novus
Ugh. And here you have my number one conundrum! While you and I seem to share similar opinions...the rest of the internet doesn't seem to agree with us. I actually tried essentially what you are talking about with Sexy Cosplay Cafe. That game had fewer locations and only a minimal number of art assets for each character/scene. Unfortunately...I got utterly, UTTERLY hazed over that game. To the point I nearly quit creating games at all. For every positive comment of any kind, there were dozens of vivid and toxic complaints about the art. To such an extent that it's eventually what pseudo-killed the game. I say pseudo-killed, because unlike Eros Academy (which died for technical reasons), I'd like to revisit Sexy Cosplay Cafe at some point, if I can. I had a lot of really good story planned for it T-T. Unfortunately, I'll never even consider it unless I can bring art assets to it that won't have the same thing happen again. It was a sadly painful lesson that appearances matter. One that caused me to start seeking out alternatives that would let me make a decent looking game to go with my storytelling. The other half of the equation is that I'm trying to push to make this a full-time thing. And I've come to the conclusion that I can't do that with Patreon alone. The whole reason I shifted gears to Left Hand Magic was because I can produce, with it, something that I personally consider (once it's all polished and fixed up) to be on the lower end of a genuinely professional production. Something that I can put up for sale on Steam or elsewhere, someday. (Though, for absolute clarity sake, it will ALWAYS remain available on Patreon. There are simply a lot of people that loathe the Patreon model, but will happily buy the game from somewhere like Steam.) To be honest, I'm a writer at heart, not any sort of artist. My actual ideal would be to expand from a solo developer to a small team at some point, and employ an actual artist to make assets for a game -_-. That way I could spend time doing the part I like and am good at, rather than trying my best to make things look pretty.
Novus
First, as I'll say to a couple of other people too...don't worry about there not being chastity content in the future ;-). I know it's one of the driving reasons a lot of people even found my work in the first place! Not to mention I like the content type myself. Part of the reason I even started including it was the lack of it anywhere else...and the fact that most of the places that DID include it tended to be...darker than I like. On that note, however, I will point you to one other adult game creator that makes stuff focused on it. In point of fact, his work was one of my first introductions to the idea of taking it in a positive-yet-kinky direction. He is, to my awareness, the ONLY other adult game creator that focuses much on it. That creator is Kerni, and if you enjoy chastity-themed content, I'd recommend taking a look at his older (first) game. (https://www.patreon.com/posts/aatofl-version-1-47642182). The one he just finished has some amount of it too, but it's less of a focus. Be aware that, while I am a fan of his work...he's not a native English speaker. The result can be...rough...at times. Though I think the community helped clean up the worst of the bad grammar in the first game. Second! The broken Chastity content in Haven's Port! Can you tell me which version of it you last played? There was a bug in Build 18 that caused EXACTLY the problem you're mentioning. Though I didn't find out about it until around release time for Build 19. That bug shouldn't exist in Build 19 any longer...or in the public version of Build 18 either. Are you still having the issue with Build 19? If so, I'll need to see if I can figure out why... Thanks for the feedback!
Bababbak
I'm mainly here for your excellent and sexy writing, and not just for the storys, but for the games as well. I really enjoyed the Cosplay caffe and the Dungeon of lewdity, and somewhat Eros Academy, since, well, there was so much story to explore, and in the case of cosplaycaffe the clear and individual way the relationships worked. Something with the feel Alya and the Magic shop gives you, but interactive and fun. (Which would make a excellent game now that i think about it :D) I also currently prefer havens port over Left Hand magic, because there is just so much more flavourfull text. I really think you put too much time into your renders. Don't get me wrong, they are pretty to look at, but the internet is already filled with porn, a lot of which is also kinda better than yours :P. So i really wish you would focus on "writing" a game, with maybe some quick drawings or character only renders, floating above a noncomittical background. There also don't need to be a lot of locations, but just a lot of content in those locations, ideally interconnected to choices or other scenes you made. A game i had just recently a lot of fun with for example, is "Princess Tower", where there are onyl a few character drawings with expressions for the most part, with only very few custom ones for key scenes. Or do you know "Lost in Laminate"? There it's basically just story, with some random pictures from the internet as flavour. I'd really love to see you put your writing skills to work to just make a text only game, and then just worry about the pictures in the end. I discovered you over Chasity Quest by the way, since that is a major fetish of mine, and i just love the way you make those softcore BDSM relationships.
Michael Faux
I originally came for the chastity content for females as apart from Skyrim with the Devious Devices mod, there are no other games out there that cover female chastity content in any way, shape or form. What has kept me around is the chastity content combined with the fact that your games actually have choices that you can make instead of being a linear path. I have played both left-hand magic and havens port and I like both even though I am more interested in havens port due to its open-world nature. While I would prefer you to at least consider keeping chastity content as one of the primary focuses of the game I will not be upset if you decide to change tact. I will stay and play whatever you put out. By the way regarding the chastity content in Haven's port is it possible for you could potentially have a look at fixing the chastity content that is currently in place in Haven's port? I don't know if it is just me but ever since the orgasm orchestra was added the game seems to think that I am always wearing the orchestra belt even if I have got it either from Mione or by the magic box and I can do the orgasm orchestra an unlimited amount of times without getting belted for 3 days as it does at the start. Based on what the dialogue suggests I don't think that's how it's supposed to work. Either way, keep going, mate!
Magykar
I came in primarily for the chastity and bondage stuff, which is frankly too rare in adult gaming, especially without going hard into feminization and all that. What kept me around beyond the initial interest though is that you don't just make standard visual novels, but games that feel like they actually have gameplay and let you make choices for the character. That's why I voted Haven's Port, because while I also like left hand magic and your variety content, I'd really like to see more adult games with actual gameplay beyond clicking "next", and you've already proven to be good at that. Now of course I would love if the fetishes were somewhat similar because that's kind of my thing, but I wouldn't be mad if they take the backseat behind whatever game idea you come up with next. Either way, keep creating, your stuff is great!
Hnnah
Personally, I'm in favor of focusing on one game at a time, finishing it, and then moving on to the next. Obviously, as you develop that game you'll understand what people like/don't like and you can use that feedback when making the next one.
