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PATRON TAKES - Family (TNG S4E2) | Star Trek Journey 183

🕑 Added 2024-08-23 00:26:06 +0000 UTC

Comments

Charlie's Illiteracy

I hear he's playing Doctor Doom next.

Charlie's Illiteracy

I'll be very surprised if you guys don't love this.

Steven McDowell

BoBW1+2 was Riker-focused, not Picard, so it makes sense

Jovet

2:38 I also agree, for Picard: Sarek > BoBW2

tyranusfan

Oh definitely. He spent much of the 1970s in Paramount exile, toiling away trying to sell new pilots that never got picked up, and then fighting to revive ST as Phase II, then the movie. In between, while enjoying himself with free sex and drugs, he started doing a lot of college lectures about humanism and his philosophy about the future, and somewhere in there, starting believing his own press. (Even great men aren't perfect.)

Keith S

Did any one mention that this episode was the first time you heard O'Brian's whole name?

#MaxwellDidNothingWrong

In my head Brent was off on a different stage with a separate crew doing a one man show for, well, you know.

Lwaxana’s Poolboy

Can’t compare the greatness of BOBW and Family. One is a Michelin star 10 course meal, the other is your mom’s home cooking.

Collin Freeman

Now that sounds like hell on earth.

Jeffrey P

I like to imagine that Brent Spiner was sitting on the bridge set all week in full makeup waiting for the film crew to arrive.

kevin coleman

I'm sorry Alex but did you just drop the hottest Killers of the Flower Moon take like it was nothing? That's insane.

Max Yoder

Josh and Alex after best of both worlds- "I hope they don't just ignore the whole thing from BBW and never come back to it" TNG- the very next episode

JGoss

In total, Berman did more good than bad. Much more.

Nolan

I may not like many of Berman's ideas and views, but I like that he respected the rules Gene laid down enough to feel shame/guilt when they were deciding to break them.

Nolan

No conflict among humans is a thing of the past, but not seeing eye-to-eye with everything your parents say or do, that's eternal. 😂🤣

JGoss

Rick Berman wrote that after Gene died, when they would discuss a story idea that involved the crew arguing or fighting with each other, he would put a towel over the Gene bust in his office.

JGoss

Don't apologize, I'm glad they read it. It provides much-needed background information

Greg Quinn

They definitely still pulled in the "bad relationship with my father" cliche a lot. Apparently Gene was okay with that.

Eric Wilson

yeah the guy plays so many parts in trek. Klingon, Feragani, MachNah syndicate, it just goes on and on.

Eric Wilson

Brett Spinner may or may not totally die as data in the coming episodes and be playing the part of a Klingon with a lot of makeup so no one knows its him.

Cirk Bejnar

While Brent Spiner appearing in future seasons is an unfortunate spoiler, it's worth noting that Data is probably the easiest character to remained without recasting. As in The Schizoid Man.

Collin Freeman

Gene Roddenberry most certainly did not want conflict in TNG. He thought humankind would advance above that by then. Consequently, the writers (and producers) tore their collective hairs out in the first 2 seasons trying to meet his expectations in that regard.

Matt Newmark

Those damned anomalies.

Steven Linden

Sorry for the long take. I just find the behind-the-scenes stuff about how various episodes end up getting made fascinating.

Steven Linden

I agree, actually. I think Gene was totally wrong about this episode in particular, but I think that his rule about no interpersonal conflict often forced the writers to be more creative. In short, I think the show is better because of Gene's rule, and also better because the writers kept trying to break it.

Steven Linden

Yeah, as much as he claimed the "ideal version of the future" thing was his vision all along, it's clearly something that was crystallized in his mind in the years between TOS and TNG. I think Roddenberry started to believe too much in his own myth.

Forbidden Donut

Overall, I'm glad that Gene fought so hard for the humans of the 24th century to be very evolved and have little to no conflict among each other, because it makes the show more unique and as another comment said it forced the writers to earn it when they got their way. DS9 pushes this more, and I wasn't always glad for it, even though I adore that show overall. Plus, it's not as if there aren't plenty of other conflicts with rival species/empires/space anomalies.

Nolan

Personally, I like that Gene had that ideal the writers had to fight against. It kept them from pulling some easy cliche tropes out in their writing, and fostered more creative ideas, and when the characters were allowed to not live up to those ideals, it made those failings that much more powerful. It's why I believe and ideal is not something you will ever attain, but should still strive for, as you'll get closer to it in the attempt than you would in admitting defeat to reality.

Andreas Schmitt

"So Gene didn't want any conflict at all?" That's actually exactly what he told the writers, yes

JD Nevesytrof

He also made another of what some thought was the best Trek movie ;)

JD Nevesytrof

"Data doesn't die in the series, SPOILER." All he said is that BRENT SPINER isn't missing.....

Joe Concepts

Your comments on Roddenberry maybe holding the show back made me think of a commentary for Star Trek II from the director Nicholas Meyer. He knew very little about the original series when he got the job, and he basically said he wasn't completely on board with the idea of humanity becoming better. He said in his mind, he saw no evidence that humanity was progressing to that. And yet, he made what SOME thought of as the best Trek movie.

Joe Concepts

Now, now, Data is only ONE character Spiner plays, right?

tyranusfan

Gene's ideas about the future evolved into some extreme places as the years went on. By the mid-80s, his ideas of ideal humans were frankly bizarre. He didn't want Jeremy Aster mourning his mom in The Bonding, either. Human perfection, in Gene's eyes, would have made for an almost unrecognizable future! It was good that Berman and Piller pulled him back (and sometimes, outright ignored him!).